SWAT4 TSS realistic force-on-force events

Hi everyone! I was thinking of a new game mode we could make up on ETS server to alternate with VIP sessions.

Enter, the force-on-force realistic sessions.

The goal is to practice moving and shooting tactics versus something less dumb than aimbot AI staring at the wall while you discuss in length what to throw him from the other side of the crate.

How do we do this with vanilla SWAT4 TSS?

Simple: first, to force attack/defence situations, set the game mode to RAPID DEPLOYMENT.
Then, remove *all this* from the available gear: flashbangs, stingers, gas, C2, sniper rifle, beanbag shotguns, *launchers*, 9mm machinepistol and long range tazer. Only pepperspray and new tazer are available for arrests (and punch), which require gutsy sneak up at close range and not spamming devices from two rooms away.

So all success or failure will exclusively have to do with each team's ability to work as a team and cover all angles and each other using lines of fire as the main concern.

Rapid Deployment mode ensures one team defends while the other attacks localised objectives, avoiding random buzzing as in BS mode. It also puts the pressure on the defensive team to develop a strategy.
I'd prefer Barricaded Suspect mode with disabled respawn (I don't like Deathmatch-like modes and prefer something what puts emphasis on teamwork) with the round being divided into 2 phases and some equipment restrictions for each team (Suspect team and Swat team).

First we put some equipment restrictions: for example no less-lethal primary (that is: beanbag shotgun, peppergun and grenade launcher), no Nightvision. We enable option "Allow specific team weapons" so that there won't be any swat officer with AK47. Also there's a special rule, Heavy Armor can only be used by suspects to help them "barricading" and putting resistance and Optiwand can only be equipped by Swat officers for reconnaissance and preparing their entry.

I phase -> Preparation Phase
Swat team stays on spawn for let's say 0.5-1 min while suspect team scatters thorought the map and decides where to actually barricade themselves. By barricading I mean: find a good spot to stay hidden, plant c2 explosives as traps on doors and wedge some of them.

II phase -> Swat entry Phase
The actual game. This is not a game for points. Points earned for kills and arrests do not matter in terms of winning&losing. There's a time limit (5min?), when Swat officers have to clear the map from all of the suspects. Should the time limit reach 0, and there's at least 1 suspect alive/not arrested, suspect team wins. If all of the suspects are killed/arrested before time counter reaches 0,Swat team wins.

I believe those rules (which of course can be adjusted apart from actual phases division preferably) are quite nice&clean as well as easy to understand. Of course both teams can use all 3 type of nades, pepperspray, wedges and ammo pouches, as well as tazers (while Cobra tazer can only be used by Swat team and standard tazer can only be used by Suspect team). Both teams can use Helmets/Gas masks as well as Light Armor or No Armor option. The ONLY rules for equipment are:
1) no less-lethal primary (including GL) as I said before
2) team specific weapons option enabled
3) Optiwand only for Swat team and Heavy Armor only for Suspect team

As for the map, it shouldn't be big (like DNA or Stetchkov Warehouse), maybe something like Foodwall, Firefax, Qwik Fuel, A-bomb, Funtime Amusements, Sister of Mercy Hostel, Drug Lab etc. Those would probably be fine.

Let me know what you think, if there are any questions, ask.
Hey there!

A very interesting proposition coming from Xyzzy. I personally always wanted to try and do something which he described here. I was never sure whether this would be a balanced kind of game mode though, but it wouldn't hurt to try out and tweak along the way. The team specific weapons and heavy armor restrictions are a great idea, the only thing I want to mention is the timer. I don't think 5 minutes would be enough for the officers to clear the whole map, but I'm sure this was just an example. Putting a timer itself isn't a bad idea, but not so it would result in the officer needing to rush through the building to find the suspects because of a timer.

I'm glad to see that some of you are trying to get some variation on the server, I think the clan could use these kind of things!
Thank you both for these inventive game modes and perhaps we can host them somewhat soon.

~ Fireline
If you see the woman with the shotgun, kill him! ~ |ETS|TaskForce141
Fireline wrote:
The only thing I want to mention is the timer. I don't think 5 minutes would be enough for the officers to clear the whole map, but I'm sure this was just an example

Exactly as you say, it was just an example but still having some time limit might be a good idea. I agree that 5 min is way too short. Swat team should be under a little bit of pressure but they shouldn't be forced to rush mindlessly just to clear the map during the time limit.
Xyzzy your idea is good too, but even with hand-thrown aids still the game wouldn't develop fully into a tactical shooting/teamwork/line of fire 3D match of skill between teams. Also, Rapid Deployment mode leave suspects team the choice what to defend, which suitcases, or barricade on 1 suitcase from the start with very difficult crossfire to beat. Only by removing stingers, bangs and gas cans entirely can the game fully develop into a pure tactical firefight.
I can see how this would be a huge disadvantage for the swat officers, for a human player to baricade himself aiming at a door, the first officer comming trough it stands little chance, and since the grenades are not too effective towards suspects behind cover. I'm pretty sure the suspects would win every time unless you balance it some other way, like restricting the suspects to lesser weapons, or having a lot more officers than suspects. What could be done would be to try starting off with some eq for suspects, if its unfair towards the officers you could restrict suspects to hand pistols only or something in that fasion. Or you could allways do as we like to do in the training sessions, force the suspects to count to 3 before they are allowed to fire after they spotted the officers.

I like this idea, it could be a lot of fun if done right.
If i were a dog and you were a flower, i'd lift up my leg and give you a shower
It might be hard but that's why Swat team should be granted Optiwands. It makes no sense to use them in Coop but they will come in handy in this mode cuz, like Jolty said, having no info about suspects whereabouts might pose some deal of danger for entry team.
For the optiwand, maybe you could only have the element leader wield it so if he dies, it's gone for the rest of the game?
I think it's more like a teamwork based game mode and there won't be a specific team leader, but I'm not against only 1 officer being equipped with an optiwand.
As Jolty said, it wouldn't be a bad idea to outbalance the teams when it comes to player amount, more officers than suspects will probably be a requirement. But as I said before, I think this is kind of trial and error, we just have to test it out and tweak it along the way (in my opinion). :)

~ Fireline
If you see the woman with the shotgun, kill him! ~ |ETS|TaskForce141
Exactly, we can only guess for now. IMO the best idea would be to test all "options" we can think about and then decide which one should we make official for this mode.
So far the interesting ideas IMO are:
1) More swat officers than suspects
2) Only 1 Opti but we should probably force only 1 or 2 HA for suspects then
3) Additional weapons restriction for suspect team
4) Forbid suspects from using grenades at all
5) Forbid suspects from camping outside the buildings

We might enforce some of those.
As for "first officer to enter dies" is arguable. It might happen but doesn't have to. That's what opti is for, also allowing only 0,5-1min prepare time for suspects will deprive them from luxury of having everything in order. They can leave some doors open, lockpick some of locked ones, camp in visible spot etc. All of this can give you a clue where they are hiding.

I believe we can "nerf" either side should we find any to be in more advantagous position ;)
It doesn't have to be assaulting Police versus barricaded suspects. It can be the other way around too, e.g. a mafia gang response team assaulting a small SWAT team who expected an easy arrest of 1 suspect (like in the series Homeland, when a team of detectives is slaughtered after calling in a SWAT unit just in case given what they have found).

It could also be teams with same equipment restrictions, force-on-force the objective would be the first one to an objective (like a suitcase, or just a room with a computer console) and hold it. Teams would have to strike the right balance between cover and speed.
Breachor's suggestion really hit the nail on this one! I've been thinking about the way how to put suspect team at less advantegous position, since just camping in some safe, unknown spot really grants them the element of surprise and at the same time an upper hand compared to Swat team which has to maneuver through unknown and dangerous territory. At the same time, I don't want the rules to be too complicated. Here's my new idea, forget those in my previous post. This one's good:

1) Let's stick to Swat team and Suspect team
2) Server settings: No less-lethal primary (includes: peppergun, beanbag shotgun and Grenade Launcher), Specific team weapons only (to avoid Swat officers with AK47 etc.), Quick rounds disabled (forces server to load map again after round ends, that's because we don't want doors which were broken in the first round to stay broken in the rest of them as they are quite important in this mode, let's say all damaged doors will be fixed next round thanks to this option), Round time limit -> 6 min (1 min = prepare time for suspects, swat officers stay at spawn and are not allowed to move, 5 min = the actual game)
3) All of the maps we play will have 2 tactical locations. Suspect team goal is to protect them from being captured while Swat team goal is to capture any one of them
4) All players are forced to use Default skin only
5) One of the Swat officers will be a Team Leader. He's the only one who can take and use Optiwand and lightsticks. He's also forced to use GIGN skin for recognition
6) Only Team Leader can take control of the tactical location. It is done by simply dropping a lightstick at any of them with the keybinded text similar to "Capturing the objective in progress" which is sent to Global Chat. Swat team must then protect the location until the time limit. Suspect team has to kill or arrest Swat's Team Leader in order to regain control of the tactical location. Team Leader is forbidden from leaving the tactical location after the capturing is initiated by him. Capturing CANNOT be initiated if there's less than 1 min before round ends.
7) Swat team wins if:
  • All suspects are eliminated before the time limit
  • One of the tactical locations is captured by Team Leader and protected by the Swat Team until the time limit
Suspect team wins if:
  • At least one of them stays alive until the time limit and no tactical location is captured by Swat team
  • All Swat officers are eliminated
  • They successfully kill or arrest Swat's Team Leader after the capturing action is initiated

As you can see, there are some possibilities to cheat, for example: Swat's Team Leader can fake a capturing process or he can leave the tactical location after capturing starts. Both actions are of course not allowed and are considered as breaking rules.
We can be our own judges, I don't think anyone's going to cheat anyway, it's just for fun. Let me know what you think.
Here are my suggestions for the weapon and tools loadout for each team
Officer
Allowed:
Colt M1911 - 8 rounds .45 ACP
Colt Python Revolver - 6 rounds .357 magnum
Deagle - 8 rounds AE
Glock 17 - 17 rounds 9x19mm
FN P90 - 50 rounds 5.7x28mm
H&K MP5 (unsupressed) - 30 rounds 9x19mm
H&K UMP45 - 25 rounds .45 ACP
Benelli Nova Tactical - 7 + 1 00/Slugs [Slow-pump makes this weapon balanced]
Remington 870 BSG - 5 rounds [Only 1 Officer should carry this]
C2 explosives - 3 charges
Optiwand [Element leader only]
Colt M4A1 Carbine - 30 rounds 5.56x45mm
H&K G36C - 30 rounds 5.56x45mm
Grenades - Flashbang, Tear Gas & Stingers
Advanced Taser M26 - 15 electrodes
Not allowed:
Intratec TEC-9
H&K MP5 (supressed) [Suspects should have a chance at hearing officers due to availability of the Optiwand]
Gal Submachinegun
Benelli M4 Super 90
Less-Lethal Shotgun
AKM (AK-47)
Colt Accurized Rifle
M249 SAW
Ammo Pouch [Officers should manage their weapon's ammo]
Pepper Spray [Officers can rush-spray]
Wedges
40mm Grenade Launcher
Stinger S-400 (Cobra) [Officers can rush-taze]
Pepperball Gun

Suspects
Allowed:
Colt M1911 - 8 rounds .45 ACP
Colt Python Revolver - 6 rounds .357 magnum
Deagle - 8 rounds AE
Intratec TEC-9 - 32 rounds 9x19mm
Gal Submachinegun - 25 rounds 9x19mm
Benelli M4 Super 90 - 4 + 1 00/Slugs [Due to Benelli M1 Super 90 not available]
Wedges [e.g., Suspects can use this to barricade themselves in a room]
AKM (AK-47) - 30 rounds 7.62x39mm
M249 SAW - 200 rounds 5.56x45mm
Not allowed:
Glock 17 [High accuracy and magazine capacity]
FN P90
H&K MP5 (supressed & unsupressed) [Suspects can easily rush officers with burst fire-mode on]
H&K UMP45
Benelli Nova Tactical [Accurate shotgun]
Less-Lethal Shotgun
Remington 870 BSG
C2 explosvies
Optiwand
Colt M4A1 Carbine [Accurate rifle]
H&K G36C
Colt Accurized Rifle
Grenades - Flashbang, Tear Gas & Stingers
Ammo Pouch
Pepper Spray
40mm Grenade Launcher
Advanced Taser M26
Stinger S-400 (Cobra)
Pepperball Gun
I really liked the ideas in Xyzzy's last post,that will be a great mode to play
The list Aladeen provided should be the best 'weapons and loadout' list we can rely on
But as Fireline said,all of this have to be tested by some of us before officially starting playing it.
Good idea Aladeen, one thing though. I'm not sure if banning suspects from using all of the grenade types as well as C2 explosives is a good idea. Sure it balances game in the initial phase but it puts them at quite an disadvantage later in game, when Swat's Team Leader starts capturing of any of the tactical locations. At that time roles are switched: Swat team is defending instead of attacking and it's them who are barricading, while Suspect team is Attacking instead of defending like in initial phase. Now imagine Swat team being able to throw nades, use cobra tazer, put their Team Leader with Optiwand watching one of the doors all the time and at the same time they plant c2 on other doors It's like Fort Knox and suspects as those who attack are left with handguns and some rifles only :D. If that was intentional, as to punish them for not protecting the both tactical locations well in the initial phase and thus making it harder for them to hunt Swat's Team Leader, it's ok. If not, them I'd advise granting suspects at least some Sting Grenades or C2.

I will elaborate about those "tactical locations" soon.

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