Top 3 players - Algorithm

Moderator: xyzzy

Hey guys,
after I posted news about the top players publishing, many of you asked me how it is counted. I'm here with the answer and I'm willing to find out the best way for counting this with you.
Remember, I'm strictly limited to ChatLog, so I can only involve what is being written to ChatLog (see what I can count with in the list below).

The current algorithm puts together points = score. At this moment, it is considering events. For each events, you get or you lose point(s). Total count of points = total score.

Positive events
  • Suspect arrested (+2)
  • Suspect neutralized (+1)
  • Civilian arrested (+1)
  • Promoted to leader (+1)

Negative events
  • Suspect illegal kill (-1)
  • Civilian kill (-2)
  • Team kill (-2)
  • Team hurt (-1)
  • Team Meele (-1)
  • Death (-1)

So, the math is:
Total Score = Positive evens score - Negative events score
Total Score = ( Suspects arrested * 2 + Suspects neutralized + Civilians arrested + Leader promotions ) - ( Suspects killed * 2 - Civilians killed * 2 - Team kills * 2 - Team hurts - Team meeles - Deaths)


Possible events to be involved
  • Player connected
  • Player kicked
  • Player banned
  • Messages sent
  • Team messages sent
  • Suspect injured
  • Civilian injured
  • Team flash
  • Team gas
  • Team sting
  • Vote leader initiated
  • Vote map initiated
  • Vote ban initiated
  • Vote kick initiated
  • Voted yes
  • Voted no
  • Name change
  • In-game teamswitch
  • Suicide

I though you might have idea how to improve this counter - add/remove event - suggest something cool - change point scoring for events.

Hunter
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Code high, commit sober.
I suggest make a suicide (-5) and a civi injured (-1) :P
also team flash,sting and gas -1
Nice work Hunter :D.
I just hope people on the server won't resign from covering teammates just to cuff sus for points...

Isn't suicide against server rules? :D
🅺🆄🆂🅷🅸🅹🅸
Why promoting to leader counts as a positive event?
Death of squad leader is certainly not a positive event.
My 2 cents:
A nice idea to bring in some competition and reward active players BUT: :geek:

I see a problem with this on some custom maps. Some maps require, lets say, a little 'adjustment' of the standard RoE 8-)
To state that cleary: these maps can be completed only by causing penalties (shot on sight), e.g. Arab-Village, NeverAlone...

Also, Im not sure if this will impact the playstyle of some players (cuffing in hot area).
Possible solution: for example on Frosty's Playhouse (less-lethal sever with score-system) the player that made the suspect surrender, gets most points, which is a good system to prevent cuffing-frenzy. This approach has its drawbacks, too. But overall its better imo.
Will be much harder to make a script like that, though.

Suicide should not give a penalty at all imo :mrgreen:

Greetings
"Um...Just one more thing..."
LessLuck wrote:
I suggest make a suicide (-5) and a civi injured (-1)
also team flash,sting and gas -1


It sounds like a good idea to me, but if so, I would adjust other events as well.

Jinxed wrote:
Why promoting to leader counts as a positive event?
Death of squad leader is certainly not a positive event.


Death of the leader is not the most common way to obtain leader status. People often choose leader before the rounds starts and they often choose someone who is good. Here is the point in adding that in score.

Columbo wrote:
My 2 cents:
A nice idea to bring in some competition and reward active players BUT:

I see a problem with this on some custom maps. Some maps require, lets say, a little 'adjustment' of the standard RoE
To state that cleary: these maps can be completed only by causing penalties (shot on sight), e.g. Arab-Village, NeverAlone...

Also, Im not sure if this will impact the playstyle of some players (cuffing in hot area).
Possible solution: for example on Frosty's Playhouse (less-lethal sever with score-system) the player that made the suspect surrender, gets most points, which is a good system to prevent cuffing-frenzy. This approach has its drawbacks, too. But overall its better imo.
Will be much harder to make a script like that, though.

Suicide should not give a penalty at all imo


Thanks for your opinion here.

We could talk about many problems that are coming together with fair results of total score, really, but putting up custom maps as a hinder is also not fair. They are not played that often and I don't believe you kill everyone on sight (some maps are exceptions, that's right), even though you change your RoE a bit. Having said that, I would rather stick with discussing score for vanilla maps. Other way, we won't be able to find out anything suitable. Anyway, I get your point here.

As I stated above, I'm limited to ChatLogs event only and that's why I can't get to know who made the suspect surrender. If it was possible, I would 100% come with it.

xyzzy93 wrote:
Isn't suicide against server rules?

It is and so are teamkills. ;)


To all of you now: :D
You are all right about the possibility of screwing the gameplay with players longing for score - cuffing suspects and civilians when they shouldn't. I'm also afraid of it. Should it not work well, I will just remove all cuffing stuff from score.
Remember, whatever we set as an algorithm, players who deserve it the most will always get it. I belive Marks, AntiTerror and you Columbo are now on the right place - with the current system that is set.

Also, I don't really mind how we set it. I'm just limited - that's what it is about. I put the current system very fast, so I could go on with the programming stuff. Application that I have developed for the Statistic-making has more that 5,000 lines and took me a month to program. It is really complex and showing the top 3 players is its very minor feature - members can tell.

Keep the thread coming guys!
Hunter
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Code high, commit sober.
Cool stuff Hunter, nicely done! :D
Good job, Hunter.

We definetely should make a difference between killing a suspect or incapacitate him, 0.5 points for killing, 1 for injuring a sus if that's possible. Same goes for civilians, with negative values of course ;) On the other hand, I think arresting civilians shouldn't be rewarded at all for obvious reasons.

I also do hope this score system won't affect people's gameplay as mentioned above, hunting for the next cheap points. But since we, the regular players, are all rather mature players (more or less), I gotta be optimistic things won't fall apart. A competetive environment isn't exactly something I'd expect while playing a tactical co-op. We're supposed to play as a team, a collective mind rather then as individuals. But I have to admit, the score system could spice things up a bit.

I think we still have a long way ahead of us to make it a reasonable score system, but it's a great start nonetheless.
Marks wrote:
We definetely should make a difference between killing a suspect or incapacitate him, 0.5 points for killing, 1 for injuring a sus if that's possible. Same goes for civilians, with negative values of course On the other hand, I think arresting civilians shouldn't be rewarded at all for obvious reasons.


Good remark, though it would probably not work the way you are expecting it to be. Killing suspect = illegal kill, incapacitating suspect = injuring suspect (=meeles). That's how it is being written into the ChatLog and I guess you smell the issue here.
I agree with you that civilian arrests should not be included.


EDIT
********************************************************************************
Well, to make thigs move (we still have a month to find out the best way.. but sure). I suggest to do it like this
We don't actually care how valuable the score can be, so to balance events, I would do it like this.
Positive events
  • Suspect neutralized (+3) (=legal kill)
  • Suspect arrested (+2)
  • Promoted to leader (+1)

Negative events
  • Suspect illegal kill (-3) (=illegal kill)
  • Civilian kill (-4)
  • Team kill (-4)
  • Suicide (-4)
  • Team hurt (-1)
  • Team meele (-1)
  • Death (-1)

I wouldn't involve team gas/flash/sting into it, as it is often not fault of the nade-thrower (blocked nade with body, bad equipment...).
Would it worth to involve "Activity" into the algorithm? I don't think so, but asking anyway.

I also though about adding special points (either + or -). (Events that might worth involving yellow highlighted)
We have got some 'top' categories like:
Top 10 Active Players
Top 5:
  • Mostly kicked players
  • Mostly banned players
  • Most leader promotions
  • Most messages sent
  • Most team messages sent
  • Most deaths
  • Most arrested suspects
  • Most neutralized suspects
  • Most killed suspects
  • Most injured suspects
  • Most arrested civilians
  • Most killed civilians
  • Most injured civilians
  • Most team kills
  • Most team injures
  • Most team melees
  • Most team flashes
  • Most team gasses
  • Most team stingers

In short, we would reward the top 3 players in each selected category with specified amount of points.
Also, how about creating a new statistic category that would count "Illegal and legal kill ratio"? I think it might work well.
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Code high, commit sober.
Nicely done Hunter keep up the good work ;)
Alright ladies,
I have been working on my application a bit more in order to improve it. I have added weapons statistics (- stay tight for details) and I plan to add the amount of failed hostages situations and suspect killed suspect event. All statistics (expect IP information) will become public the next month. Other than improving my application, I have come with the 'final' scoring system that will be used for this and following months unless you come with something better.

The scoring system now works like this:

Positive events: Legal kill (+3), Suspect arrested (+2), Promoted as leader (+1), Legal/Illegal kill ratio times 6 (Example: If your ratio is 5,6, then you will recieve 5,6 x 6 = 33,6 points)

Negative events: Illegal kill (-3), Civilian kill (-4), Team kill (-4), Team injure (-1), Team melee (-1), Death (-1), Suicide (-4)

Bonus points:
    Rated in:
  • TOP 3 - Most legal kills: 1. +15 ; 2. +10 ; 3. +5
  • TOP 3 - Most leader promotions: 1. +15 ; 2. +10 ; 3. +5
  • TOP 3 - Most illegal kills: 1. -15 ; 2. -10 ; 3. -5
  • TOP 3 - Most deaths: 1. -15 ; 2. -10 ; 3. -5


You guys maybe think this will take us to huge score value, but it is not like that. Just a little compare here:
July TOP 3 by old system:
ETS|RC_Marks (1362)
AntiT3rror (1149)
Columbo (1147)

July TOP 3 by new system:
|ETS|RC_Marks (1295)
Columbo (1173)
AntiT3rror (1044)


The TOP 3 won't be updated on the server this month. I don't want AntiT3rror to be angry with me. :D

Hunter
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Code high, commit sober.
Just my 2 cents:
Illegal kill (-3) = penalty for shooting at an armed suspect (who might just have gunned down 3 innocent humans) without asking him nicely to surrender first
Death (-1) = penalty for having a team-mate which cares for the penalty mentioned above
Raptor wrote:
Just my 2 cents:
Illegal kill (-3) = penalty for shooting at an armed suspect (who might just have gunned down 3 innocent humans) without asking him nicely to surrender first
Death (-1) = penalty for having a team-mate which cares for the penalty mentioned above


Good, but how else would you do that? As I have stated somewhere above, I'm limited to ChatLog and Illegal kill is therefore something I can't alter. I know that 'illegal kill rule' brings up the question with bugs and with what you wrote, but remember, removing this rule wouldn't be 'fair' either. Also, don't forget that this rule works for everyone the same, meaning that players are not left behind if they happen to face bug or the fact that they are being forced to give some payback.
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Code high, commit sober.
How about counting the total score?
For example:
(total score/2)/№ of players = № of points
If 1 player achieved a perfect score:
(100/2)/1=50
If 3 players achieved a perfect score:
(100/2)/3=16
I wonder its really fine for +3 points for legal kill and +2 for arrest. I understand thats some players will arrest in hot spots for points, but same with killing, player(s) don't care about arrest. Arresting is harder cuz need tactic to most effective entry and make suspect give up, suspect alway may pick up gun... but legal kill its much easier than arrest suspects, just shot and no worries about danger from suspect side, no need nades, not much tactic... On custom maps, where is a lot suspects and harder to get arrest, legal killing is easier way and yet, you get more points for that. I met some players (I dont wanna say nicks) which played that way and i wondered why they choice that way, no use nades, just enter and legal kill. Now when i read that, i got my answer.

I would suggest move back to old style, +3 points for arrest, +2 for legal kill.

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